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What is BUY & SELL on Betfair/Betdaq?

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  • What is BUY & SELL on Betfair/Betdaq?

    Hi,
    I wonder how do you percieve these two terms on betting exchange?

    Lay = BUY (we want to buy for low price and sell at higher price)
    Back = SELL (we want to sell for high price and then buy at lower price)

    or

    Lay = SELL (we are offering a bet to somebody)
    Back = BUY (we are buying a bet from somebody)

    or

    first bet = ENTRY = BUY (and then we sell out)

    or

    something else?

    We have big discusion on our Czech forum and it seems that everyone has different opinion.

    Thanks for any comments
    34
    Back = Buy & Lay = Sell
    23.53%
    8
    Back = Sell & Lay = Buy
    41.18%
    14
    Who gives a feck!
    35.29%
    12
    See my website www.chrtba.com

  • #2
    Buy - Sell
    Long - Short
    Bid - Ask
    Betfair is not the answere, it's the question.
    ....and the answere is NO!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Hello, yeah, this is a spreads index term.

      Buy is to back, Sell is lay.

      The spreads 'Over-Rounds' were bigger than the

      exchanges commission, so they lost out.

      Comment


      • #4
        Your wrong Ted, in spreads term Buy means Lay and Sell means back.
        Remember in betting we wish Back high and Lay low.
        So Back is in Spread-Betting same like Sell, (going)Short or Ask.
        Lay is Buy, (going)Long or Bid.
        Betfair is not the answere, it's the question.
        ....and the answere is NO!!!

        Comment


        • #5
          With shares to make a profit you have to sell at a higher price than you buy.

          In sports trading, to make a profit you have to back at a higher price than you lay.

          So Back = Sell & Lay = Buy.

          What's new in version 1.2

          Comment


          • #6
            It's back and lay because its back and lay, nobody is buying or selling anything, their betting.... had to be awkward
            Edges are ten-a-penny, execution is everything

            Read My FULL-TIME Racing Traders Blog Here!!
            T F YouTube

            Comment


            • #7
              I see it as buying and selling risk.

              So, when you are laying you are buying risk, and when you are backing you are selling risk.

              Therefore, for me it's:
              Back = Sell
              Lay = Buy

              Even though I have to say that one feels that they ought to be the other way around.

              But, I think that as we have demonstrated here that there is confusion and these terms shouldn't be used.

              - Malc

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by tomas.tomass View Post

                We have big discusion on our Czech forum and it seems that everyone has different opinion.

                Thanks for any comments
                Seems to be one here too.

                What's new in version 1.2

                Comment


                • #9
                  When you want the price to go higher in shares you are buying. You are buying at low price for example:
                  I want to buy shares of Betfair at 750 because I think they will go high, so I buy.
                  Its same with the odds - if you want the price to go higher because for example:
                  I think that the odds on the horse "Derivatives" (why would I choose such a name? ) will go higher from 3 to 3.50. Thats why I will lay that horse - which is equal to buy. Its same with the back - Sell :P
                  Lay = buy
                  Back = sell
                  The odds of succes dramaticly improve with each attempt

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by LuckyYou View Post
                    When you want the price to go higher in shares you are buying. You are buying at low price for example:
                    I want to buy shares of Betfair at 750 because I think they will go high, so I buy.
                    Its same with the odds - if you want the price to go higher because for example:
                    I think that the odds on the horse "Derivatives" (why would I choose such a name? ) will go higher from 3 to 3.50. Thats why I will lay that horse - which is equal to buy. Its same with the back - Sell :P
                    Lay = buy
                    Back = sell
                    Only trouble is its not shares! theirs no divedends and you dont own a stake of anything.... its a bet on an outcome
                    Edges are ten-a-penny, execution is everything

                    Read My FULL-TIME Racing Traders Blog Here!!
                    T F YouTube

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      When you Buy a stock, you have to have the money in your account, just like Laying, i.e., if I had £100, I could only Lay a pony for £10 @ 11. If I was to Short/Sell a Stock, I do that on the proviso that I will buy it back at a later date, or, with sports, there will be a defined outcome at which point there is no going back, unlike normal stock behaviour [unless it's de-listed].
                      I would be able to Back the same pony for £100 @ 11. Hence, the potential profit from Backing, will give me more purchase to Buy/Lay at a point in the future on an event that has not yet been finalised and with funds that I don't actually have in my account - subject to the Back price being in positive leverage =>2.


                      Backing = Selling

                      Laying = Buying


                      * Seeing as we are talking shares; My Betfair Share Price Prediction 08/07/11----- Betfair Share Price 26/01/12 = 863p

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Pretty much with Chuck here.

                        Generally people that talk in those terms only do so to compare with the stock market, so really has to be used in those terms, but the reality is those terms should only really be used when comparing them for others benefit to comprehend what we are doing.
                        Technical thinking says if you have to use those terms, then buying is to back a horse as you are buying a bet, and laying you are selling a bet.
                        A bookmaker lays horses and they are selling. You can't claim they are buying anything. They are offering a price in the hopes that you will buy a bet off them. A bookmaker sells to a punter who buys from the bookmaker.

                        So if you have to use those terms, then buying has to be backing, and selling has to be laying.
                        But the reality is, you are just backing and laying and the use of those terms just overcomplicates a simple process.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You have a house, for example, and you go to an insurance company to insure it.

                          You are making a bet that your house will burn down within that one year, they have laid* you that bet.

                          They have bought that risk off you for the cost of the premium, which is what we know as the stake, when they laid your bet. You have sold that risk to them when you backed it.

                          Note the lack of mention of shares, divedends and the like. I could have used other examples such as futures or options for the same. As I have said before this feels back to front and I admit that, at first glance I would have said that buying was backing but, in actual fact, it runs contrary to what seems obvious.

                          Hope that this helps.

                          malc




                          (* note the spelling, folks)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            It's a good pub quiz question

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hiya Guy's,
                              ....er....yeah, before the exchanges opened, (about a decade ago) I was a regular spread betting wallah, looks like most of them have 'thrown the towel' in, leaving Sporting Index in pole pos'n.

                              We were backers if we bought the spread/layers if we sold it. Here's todays racing mkt's from Sporting

                              http://www.sportingindex.com/spread-...-racing-6-race

                              Perhaps it's different for forex ?

                              Comment

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